Ask the Nutritionist: Dr. Getty's Forum for Equine Nutrition
Welcome to my forum.
Here you will find more than 6 years of questions and my answers. It is searchable and offers a great deal of information.
Currently, I am discontinuing new questions. This may change in the future, but in the meantime, please know that It has been a true pleasure serving you.
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All the best,
Dr. Getty
Hi Judy,
Excellent suggestion and it is delightful to read how well your horses are doing.
All the best,
Dr. Getty 
I would also recommend a slow feeder such as the freedom feeder,i have been using them for about 8 months now and love them,i have three horses and they didnt do good with the free feeding with out the nets,i can now load up the nets and they have learned that they can come and go as they please and the hay is always there,i put in a normal days amount and it takes them 24 hrs to finish and some times they still have hay left over.They also prefer the hay in the nets instead of the hay on the ground.Hope you will try one, you and your horses will love them
I ordered mine from www.forevernaturalequine.com
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Hi Alice,
Frustrating can backfire on you since it causes stress and that leads to a hormonal response that can induce laminitis. So, I recommend taking it very, very slowly, allowing her to have grass hay free choice, along with it in the net (or whichever slow feeder you choose). I would also contact the manufacturer and talk to them about the problems you're experiencing -- they will likely offer you some suggestions on how to mount it and make it easier for your horse to use.
Please keep me posted.
Best regards,
Dr. Getty
Dr. G she is getting VERY frustrated with the nibble net and has learned to bite and flip it to get bits of hay to drop on the floor (even though she's on rubber mats that's not exactly what I had hoped for.)That works faster than trying to nibble and pull through the holes. You know when she has finished as the banging stops
I can get Quiessence and start her on that. She gets pretty regular excercise and it will increase more as out weather is starting to cool off.
Judy re: the freedom freeder, How does the top stay closed? That may be better to keep her from flipping the net and I could put quite a bit more in it.....to get her through the night without running out.
Thanks again
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Thank you, Jennifer for your suggestion. Yes, there are many available -- I recently came accrose this one that is very nice -- www.work4feeder.com
All the best,
Dr. Getty
http://www.heunetzshop.de/Heunetze-aller-Art/Grossraum-Heunetze-knotenlos:::6_13.html (copy and paste!)
These are available in the US too, afaik (don't know the supplier though). You can use another snap or similar to tie it to the wall on the bottom too, then your mare can't flip it anymore. This would work with a regular hanging hay net too.
If you google slow feeders you find quite a few websites showing people's inventions and solutions.
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Hi Dr.Getty. My mare is at 2 scoops of Quiessence per day and will increase by one scoop/wk. I have changed her back to the feeder with 4" holes as she really did get progressivly upset with the 1 1/2" holes.She's fed 3 times per day. I will try the small holes again after she has been on 4 scoops of Quiessence for awhile. If that still doesn't work I will look at other models after the holidays....So all suggestions are appreciated.
Our dealer gets hay from different areas and states each time so I was hesitant to have it tested each time. I do want to get her to a 24/7 schedule and it may end up trial and error with different feeder nets.
Her weight appears good at present (haven't taped her) but she has not had a cresty neck nor any indications of laminitis thus far, Thank Goodness. It is a work in progress for sure!!!
Thanks again for all the suggestions and information.
Hello Alice,
I have recently come across this feeder (don't know if I recommended it to you) -- it's called Work 4 Feeder: www.work4feeder.htm
It is not a net, but a feeding mechanism that slows down the rate of hay consumption and when I spoke to the owner, he claims that it does not cause the frustration that hay nets can cause. I recommend contacting him -- His name is Rick Huffman and his contact information is on the bottom of the webpage.
Keep me posted,
Dr. Getty
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
Our dealer gets hay from different areas and states each time so I was hesitant to have it tested each time. I do want to get her to a 24/7 schedule and it may end up trial and error with different feeder nets.
Her weight appears good at present (haven't taped her) but she has not had a cresty neck nor any indications of laminitis thus far, Thank Goodness. It is a work in progress for sure!!!
Thanks again for all the suggestions and information.
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Hi Jennifer,
Thank you for your patience during this holiday season.
You are absolutely correct about a hay belly. Many folks mistake this as fat when in fact, it is not fat, but gas! Horses typically put on body fat in places other than the underside of the belly. Consumption of hay results in gas, which is normal and actually healthy. Too much gas, however, can be an indication of poor quality hay, mold, worm infestation, etc. (which is a topic for another day).
The mare was 1200 lbs, which may or may not be overweight for that particular horse. But even normal weight horses can have fat deposits along the neck, back, shoulders, etc., which would be an indication of insulin resistance. So, weight, in and of itself, is not the only indicator.
And bottom line... a hay belly is not an indicator of body fat.
Thank you for bringing this up!
Happy New Year,
Dr. Getty
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
rereading this today made me come up with a question. Here is a quote from the very first post from Alice:
"She was close to 1200 and had a HUGE belly when I cut her back. She has never had a cresty neck. How long should I give her to adjust or should I just give up?"
Can it be that the mare had not gotten fat at all, but had just gotten a hay belly?
In my experience many people confuse horse with a hay belly with a fat horse.
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Thank you!
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
UPDATE:
Yesterday I stuffed a haynet I had used in a former trailer. I then used another net (doulbled netted) over that to make the holes just a little smaller. I suppose it held about 15lbs. of hay and hung it in the corner next to her regular feeder. I continued to give the am, noon, and pm feeds in her regular feeder and had to refill the haynet before going to bed. I don't think she stopped eating all day yesterday!!! but today she is actually sunning herself and taking long breaks from the hay!!! Yipee
My question now Dr. Getty is how long is it safe to continue the 4 scoops of Quiessence a day?
Jennifer I think you made a good point about the haybelly but I do think she was over weight as well. I will have to keep and eye and increase excercise or digestive aids as needed.
I'm thinking she is a real EASY keeper as my 25 yr. T.B and 11 yr. APHA mare do ok on this hay with no problems. They are all wormed on a regular basis and the hay I get is fresh smelling, good color etc. But at least for now... I think your advise, Dr, G, of never letting her run out of hay and the Quiessence seems to have worked!
Where are you from? Nevada
Greetings Alice,
How wonderful!! Congratulations! It takes patience and you are to be commended.
I am going to create a document of testimonials about self-regulating and horse owners' experiences. I'd like to include yours, if I have your permission.
About Quiessence... once you start to see her losing fat deposits along the crest of her neck, along her spine, shoulders, tail head, etc., you can start to reduce the amount you feed. You'll want to always give her some magnesium -- 1 to 2 scoops daily, but you can start decreasing it from 4 scoops, down to 3, once you are visually recognizing results. Keep a vigilant eye for any return of fat deposits and increase the Quiessence, if necessary.
Best wishes,
Dr. Getty
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
Yesterday I stuffed a haynet I had used in a former trailer. I then used another net (doulbled netted) over that to make the holes just a little smaller. I suppose it held about 15lbs. of hay and hung it in the corner next to her regular feeder. I continued to give the am, noon, and pm feeds in her regular feeder and had to refill the haynet before going to bed. I don't think she stopped eating all day yesterday!!! but today she is actually sunning herself and taking long breaks from the hay!!! Yipee
My question now Dr. Getty is how long is it safe to continue the 4 scoops of Quiessence a day?
Jennifer I think you made a good point about the haybelly but I do think she was over weight as well. I will have to keep and eye and increase excercise or digestive aids as needed.
I'm thinking she is a real EASY keeper as my 25 yr. T.B and 11 yr. APHA mare do ok on this hay with no problems. They are all wormed on a regular basis and the hay I get is fresh smelling, good color etc. But at least for now... I think your advise, Dr, G, of never letting her run out of hay and the Quiessence seems to have worked!
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Yes, I hope my experience will help others so you are welcome to use it. I am going to get my other two horses on a 24/7 feed as well.....I love the idea I'll be able increase riding time simply because I'm not preparing and giving 3 meals per day to three horses! Stuffing a big net once a day will be a real time saver. Plus, I won't be waiting for them to finish a meal or get a good start if I want to go for a ride or something. They should always be pretty satisfied... hay wise. Libby seems so much calmer and less food frantic by far. By the way, I cut the holes larger on the first net I orderd and she's eating from it fine. The holes were 1.5" square. Now they are 1.5 x 3 inches. Can't wait to see how my more high strung mare will do.
Thanks again Dr Getty and everyone for all their suggestions!
Where are you from? Nevada
Hello Alice,
Yes, I hope so as well -- many folks are concerned that their horses will get too fat or colic with free-choice hay, when in fact, it does the opposite. Horses lose weight because they are no longer producing stress hormones (which cause the body to stay fat). And, colic risk is reduced because an empty stomach causes colic, not the other way around.
And the extra benefit is that you end up with a horse who feels better and therefore, behaves better.
It's a win-win all around!
Thank you!
Dr. Getty [:]
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
Thanks again Dr Getty and everyone for all their suggestions!
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Judy I wanted to thank you as I got a "Freedom Net" for Libby and it is working great. The nice thing about is that it holds enough for a full 24-30 hours. It really cuts down on trips to the barn. As this mare is such an aggressive eater I am glad I went through 3 other nets with progressivly smaller holes. Had I went with the Freedom Net at first....I think she would have had fits! I'm going to get one for my other two but they should be easy to transition over as they are not the pigs that Libby is Thanks again!
Where are you from? Nevada
Hi Alice,
As with any slow feeding system, it is important to gradually allow the horse to become adjusted to it. If introduced all at once, it can cause frustration, which can defeat the purpose (leads to cortisol release, which leads to fat storage). So you are to be commended for taking your time with this.
Best regards,
Dr. Getty
Thanks again!Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Hi Judy,
Fabulous! I have heard many good things about your product.
Dr. Getty
You are welcome! I have loved my Freedom Feeders so much i have become a distributor.
Thank you Dr Getty for helping people understand how inportant it is to free feed horses.
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
YES!!!I know what you mean about them being calmer. I feel guilty I had not thought of this before....especially since we do not have big pastures here (like when I was growing up in the Midwest)and the horses are kept in a dry corral. For the good of the horses, I hope this method really catches on.
Hi Jane and Alice,
It is so wonderful to have you both discuss the benefits of allowing horses to simply be horses -- they are innately designed to graze all of the time. Everyone has a different set up so it takes some creativity and the Paddock Paradise is an excellent choice. It allows for movement in a relatively small space.
Thank you and keep spreading the concept to others. It is really not at all new -- it's the way horses have lived for millions of years.
All the best,
Dr. Getty
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO
Hi Diana,
Thank you for the advice.
I have seen some problems with a loose shoe getting caught in hay nets so I like to recommend a different slow feeder design called Work 4 Feeder -- www.work4feeder.com.
But, as with any slow feeder, it is very important to allow the horse to become comfortable with it. Frustration can cause a hormonal response which actually keeps the horse overweight and could induce laminitis.
All the best,
Dr. Getty
Author of Feed Your Horse Like A Horse
Once I receive the XL sizes, I will keep the Standard size for use in my trailer, and around my property for them to "graze" on.
Where are you from? Bayfield, CO